TXJune ’10 Exams POLL – Paper F6 was … Post your comments here

did u guys take the rent for the 3rd office building in the second question? Also what about advertising did you take that as well for 2009/10? otherwise was more theory than I thought but I think the time and energy I dedicated to this has gone waste, specially the motor cars allowances took a long time....

I didn't think that the paper was too bad but I went in only having watched the revision lectures and with my past knowledge of self assessment and having done 1 corporation tax return.
So I may be totally wrong but I question the guys that said there was no personal income tax calculations.
Q1 involved a partnership, aren't partnerships just two personal income tax calculations together?

I rather think the paper was within reach with respect to the concepts examined! The issue actually is the very lengthy nature of questions 1 & 2.

After weeks of practicing every question in the exam kit none of the questions resemebled any of the past exams questions. Why was there a 15 mark question on administration regarding fines and penalites for not disclosing capital gains? The captail gains question was one of the toughest ever all that indexation....hope I get 50% because I don't think I could face sitting the exam again!!!!

I did not take the rent in calculation of property income for the 3rd office building as it is on accruals basis (would be for next period), so the total for the building came as allowable loss. Also the cost of insuarance for one of the buildings had to be proportioned as only part of the period was covered in that tax year.
Who got what in the question where the payments on account had to be made for CT? 1) one assosiated company - got 0 in last installment; 2) no assosiated companies - repayment of 1,500 was due.

very different from past papaers, from Pilot paper! I did Pilot for almost 100%, now I hardly hope for 50%! and what does this format mean? 2-3 mark part examining the whole book, no income tax computation at all, lots of small things like NIC and VAT and tax fines, lots of unusual terms like 'business rates'...it was awful...

Kisugem,

I ve got the same as you .... :)

Good luck to all that suffered. I think I managed 45-55%, it's going to be a long wait for results. It has made me feel better reading the comments from fellow strugglers, I do find it amazing that someone who cannot type English can feel confident in their performance.
The VAT payment part of Q1 was 2/3 marks so limited thought required. The business rates I have treated the same as Council Tax and included it as an allowable expense and deducted from the rent received to calculate wear and tear allowance.
A tough but fair paper, there were enough marks available for basic questions for an average student to pass and for those of us who have not done the work, we will get what we deserve...a second go in Decemeber.

What the Hell of F6 this yr? i also did around 80% Revision kit. when i saw paper Q1, i suprised what VAT Q is it! then went to Q2 which made me so depressed. then when Q3, i was like i can do it . but when i really did, it's no idea to write out . why examiner so so so ? dun noe how to mention this exam paper. surely DIFFERENT 100% . wish for 50!

I was shocked when I opened the question paper, lots of information to digest and lots to apply in a very limited timescale. I felt it leaned heavily on knowledge of VAT, administration and companies. From this experience I have learnt it is best to cover and have understanding of all of the syllabus, as that is what should be expected of me and not to rely heavily on the format of past papers for question style, even though it does help a lot in gaining understanding and concepts. At least we can find solace that we are not the only ones feeling "worried" about how they answered the questions. Some points may be raised at the markers meeting with the examiner and he may allow us some credit for unfair presentation of questions. I hope I will get 50%.

I think this exam was difficult and just within the rules, where were all the BIK, PPR, Income tax computation, Difficult chargeable gains, theory, business rates, 50 MOTORS CARS, A jOKE.

@acltang72 said:
Yeh so different from the past papers! No income tax computation :( questions were in a weird order. New poll on who thought the paper was fair?

Can you imagine... ??

I hope the examiner forgot that we teach ourselves and esp for who has different teaching/learning background.

I got it very difficult & I couldn't manage the time to entertain all questions

i stand by side with all comments, i thought paper will be tough but not so much like this one. this is totally different from past ones. i hope i get 50 at least.....

drunk paper i dont know what is going to be happened

Thought this paper was really hard! Especially all the cars I got in a muddle! Fingers crossed for the 50% but don't hold out much hope :(

Did examiner took into consideration that most of students are working and they are spending money and time. We are not asking for easy exam but we do ask for REASONABLE one.At the end we are preparing months ago and we deserve better treatment.


Thank you examiner and I hope new examiner for December sitting.

i hope the person marking our exam is happily drunk when checking the papers and gives easy marks otherwise i dont know whats going to happen :(

There was a lot of theory in this paper and completely different layout from past exam papers... Not happy with this paper at all...

@adbashar said:
Did examiner took into consideration that most of students are working and they are spending money and time. We are not asking for easy exam but we do ask for REASONABLE one.At the end we are preparing months ago and we deserve better treatment.


Thank you examiner and I hope new examiner for December sitting.

I do agree with you...

its kind of depressing such an unfair exam.....the 15 minutes for reading were not suficient at all....

Good thing I was drunk when I took the exam because I managed to finish it in time.;)

Anyone remember the loss reliefs... It was the 180k. I think I applied all of that on carry back loss relief against general income.. as much as I could in T=0 and T=-1 and then I limited my loss reliefs to the initial years taking advantage of the temporary extension (maximum 50k in t=-2 and t=-3) However, I also apportioned the loss relief for the short 9 month accounting period in t=-3 so that the 50k max was in fact 43750 (21/24 x 50k). I applied as much as I could and carried forward the remaining balance for the first available loss relief in the future. I had unrelieved gift aid in t=-2 of 1500 or something like that.

There was also grossing up for that dividend from the non associated foreign company. I've now realised that was Franked Investment Income but i stupidly put it in investment income. Ah well.

In terms of all that undisclosed capital gains crap all i remember was that there was a max penalty for deliberate and concealed error of 100% of PLR. then of course I rationed it out that if there was an unprompted disclosure there was a minimum band of 30% (or so i think). Interest accrued from the due date (Jan 31st 2010) at the interest rate of 2.75%.

For the professional ethics part I hadn't read the following question and started talking about advising the client that he would be stupid because they could always exercise inspection and information powers and raise a discovery assessment. If I were a CCA I would certainly tell the guy that he's a knob and to fork up the cash.

VAT wasn't so bad was it? Flat rate was fairly simple. They gave us the input and output VAT.

As for the partnership (Q1), and the capital gains (Q3) I was quite perplexed. I thought the FA 1985 share pool was quite straightforward and the indexed rises at each operative event was not anything should have not expected. However, the fact that the damage was to be treated as a part disposal and did not have any business relief was confusing, specially with the adjustment to base cost (although that was only worth a mark). Land disposal was quite straightforward. Rollover relief was straightforward too... Indexed cost helped take some calculation out of the way. It was common sense from there.

I think all in all it was a very challenging paper, and I'd love to hear thoughts on the aforementioned comments. I was hoping for a high mark and had covered the entire syllabus but in light of the change of format I think I'd be lucky to get a pass.

Dissapointing very dissapointing,,,,,,,,how can tax qtns contain about 45% written??????

@platinumkp

It was to my understanding that we apportion the £50,000 if the year of loss is less than 12 months long, in this case it wasn't therefore the full £50,000 should have been allowed? It can be apportioned when a business ceases to trade where relief is only allowed to be carried back 36 months prior to cessation.

I think the question only asked for the PCTCT so therefore we should ignore the FII as that is only added to arrive at profits.

I could be wrong! But that was my approach

@acltang72

Thanks for your response. I wish I had time to look into the textbook to investigate in greater detail but you sound well versed so I'll give you the benefit of the doubt. Unfortunately for me, it's cramming for F9.

i think we shud let acca know about it...if more thn 40 percent of paper includes theory then whts the point of doing so much nemerical work in taxation ...

@ali_abbas

It would be funny to see you work as a tax adviser for a client, get the computations right just to miss the deadline. It will be rough explaining to the client that you didn't file it on time and don't know the consequential penalties.

Let's face it; the examiner was within the scope of the syllabus. We can't blame others for forgetting that this is a Professional examination.

No you have to apportion the 50000 for shorter periods, I went through the entire losses chapter after the paper and know this. You dont have to apportion it for income tax I think otherwise I really would have remembered it.

@ platinumkp
Franked investment income is actually grossed up, the net figure is mentioned as dividends not franked investment income.

The problem with the penalties for CGT was that it wasnt clear if the error was "concealed" or not so I calculated the penalties for both "delibrate but not concealed" and "delibrate and concealed". The interest rate is 2.5% not 2.75...

There was no part disposal on the damaged asset. If all the proceeds are re-invested then the person can claim to not treat it as part disposal, it doesnt have to be a business asset.

@gambler747

I agree on the apportionment of the 50k.

You are right about the reinvestment of the proceeds from the damage. Gain can be deferred if reinvested within 12 months. Good job.

I liked your approach on the deliberate CGT evasion.

Dope... I messed up on the interest rate for tax. That sucks. Maybe i'll get some credit for the dates? Who knows. Is it possible to get half of half a mark?

sounds like you know ur stuff. I would be surprised if I were to hear you didn't pass.

The paper is only comprise of VAT, VAT & VAT

To be honest I didn't actually remember the part disposal thing on damaged assets, if all the proceeds wouldn't have been reinvested then I would have got it wrong.

The rate of interest was actually given in the paper so it's not something you were supposed to remember. It's just like a mathematical error and wouldn't really be penalized for more than a mark I think. You would be given credit for remembering the correct percentage of penalty.

Ya I honestly cannot see myself failing this, I don't know how I'll handle that situation if it happens. The only question I completely messed up was the losses one and it was 7 marks so I am not really worried about it. In fact I am expecting 60%+ and wouldn't be surprised if I got 70%+. Unlike subjective papers, it's not difficult to get 100% marks in tax questions. Good luck to you 2, by the looks of it I am sure you'll pass.