SBR*** P2 December 2011 Exam was: Post your comments and vote in Instant Poll ***

The question 3 part c is not a big fuzz.... al you need to know is the recognition criteria... a football player is human who is not controllable... for a intangible to be recognuzed it has to be controllable just like a normal asset, and his future benefits are not known like that of another asset.. since the registration is for a player then we should think in that perspective.. but i'm not 100% sure this is just what i wrote...

Question 3 was really hard. Did anyone else just not see the issues? And the WACC???

It was like nothing I'd ever seen before and I've done all the questions in the BPP Study text!

For Question 3 re the football players I said that the players are assets and all fees should be capitalised with them under IAS 16 (See question Seejoy in BPP study text). Is this way off? Think I may have done a strong question 1 and 4 so hoping for 50!

Q3 was awkward, for the agents fees to capitalised that would indicate that they are involved in the aquisition of an asset. Football players are not assets, they are employees of the club.

Like wise agents are employees of the football who act on their behalf.

BUT it was not clear wether the club was purchasing the "RIGHTS" of that player eg David Beckham image is a "BRAND" but the player is an employee.

BUT the club does not have exclusive control over the brand, the player can obviously not do an advert or have there image tarnished purely for the sake of money.

It was a very difficult question to model and I think the examiners will get a variety of answers.

Maybe its one of those ones that a good argument will gain you good marks regardless of right or wrong.

LOAN was difficult it was 29m and then impared to 3x8m=24m then the current rate was 8% so this was your discount rate and then you had either 6.3% or 6.7% ( i think) I used the 6.3% as this is the cashflows that would be rec'd from the bond and then discounted at 8%.

Which gave me something like 25.36 PV of bond and you had to write down from 29 which was the carrying value in the accounts

The roof should've been capitalised, as it is a repair although I argued that it was maintenance and shouldn't so I dropped something there. Question 4 was do-able if you knew the rules and Question 2 I didn't do.

We will have to see how the marks go, I think I will either have a marginal fail or marginal pass. Fingers crossed.

I thought it was a strange paper - expected hard and got hard!
Q1 I thought the consolidation itself was ok (as in no foreign currency issues, no Associate, convenient dates etc). Would have much preferred a Cash Flow question but heigh-ho....
Didnt know what to do with the loan. Segmental reporting hopefully I got enough points in to pick up a few marks. With any luck hope I scored at least 30 on this question.

Q2 - went for this as 13 marks for the restated SFPs seemed quite generous. Tricky adjustments, but stuck to first principles and kept all 3 SFPs in balance throughout. Wasn't sure where to allocate the restructuring costs, but calculated the discounted NPVs of the redundancy costs so hopefully will pick up marks for those. Discussion parts of question harder.
Hope for 10-15 marks on this question.

Started Q3 - 5 minutes wasted, crossed it out - killer!

Q4 - Every point about Revenue Recognition I could manage. Again did the discounting using the rates given. Hope for 10-15 again if I'm lucky.

If I score 50 on this paper I have completed my ACCA and can officially retire from exams forever.
Thank you to Open Tuition for helping me with P2 (and saving me from giving BPP any more of my money!).
I will be spreading the word :)

I agree with the feedback that this P2 paper was difficult. I can't imagine why would an examiner test you to complete a 4 hour paper in 3 hours. It's a real world. I have been in a managerial position for the last 7 years, yes you have urgent tasks to deliver on time but not like this paper where you have to be shape, quick and accurate in all areas -IAS, IFRS and completing SOFP "neatly. What a test how much more challenging can ACCa exams get! Fully prepare is just part of it, so many times you score between 40 - 49 marks, with no flexibility to consider one potential. Good luck to the young and faithful.

Anybody please tell me whats the treatment of LAND with carrying value of 56m and fair value of 64 million is Cost of investment in Q1 Consolidated SOFP? How we treat that?

muju said 19 hours, 6 minutes ago:

Question: How many balls are there in an over?
Answer: 6(SIX)

If this were a ACCA exam question the answer would be WRONG and the examiner’s comment in the suggested answers would be

“Most of the students answered the question. However, students have not understood the question correctly. Answer points to a lack of in-depth understanding and conceptual clarity on the subject. Correct answer is 1 ball which is delivered 6 times, if the umpire did not declare any no ball in all those deliveries. In case the umpire declares a No Ball as defined in the Byelaws 24 Rule 3 of the Laws of Cricket (Lords), then there will be an additional ball delivered for every no ball declared by the umpire. Similarly for wide under Byelaw 25 Rule 3 of the Laws of Cricket (Lords) an additional ball will be delivered for every wide ball declared by the umpire. Note that such additional balls will not be counted towards the number of balls…:D

Muju I just read your comment, it's so funny but you are deep. You have made a good summary of what a great many of past and present ACCA students think in terms of their chances of being correct. i love your analysis.

lindencourt said 22 hours, 35 minutes ago:
This is finally it with the ACCA for me. I have decided to quit. P5 exam last week was a total joke and now this P2 exam! The text books and preparation material for these exams are far, far too inadequate for what is now thrown at us in these exams. I have no confidence in passing any future ACCA exams as it is now become a bit of a lottery. You might be lucky to win with a question on a subject that you know enough about to answer, but the broad range of accountancy knowledge that we have all gained from our studies is simply not tested. I have more confidence in winning in a casino than passing another ACCA exam. The ACCA examiners seem to test just a small part of the syllabus, sometimes even an obscure element without contentrating on the broader aspects that we are all prepared for. I feel they do not test us for being future accountants. Surely that what the exams should be about?

Perhaps the ACCA is getting short of cash so they screw the students by making the exams ridiculously hard for the vast majority of students so we have to retake, and then retake again …which mean more cash for the hard-up ACCA coffers.

What has really got me about today’s P2 exam was that the examiner is a football fan and asked us a 9 mark question about football players transfer and agents fees and other issues relating to football. I HATE FOOTBALL and I do not even know what the question was taking about. What is a transfer fee? There was simply not enough information there for people like me to understand the question. 9 marks about transfer fees!!! That was 9 potential marks gone. Its a joke.

Q4 . Revenue – I do not remember reading about these conceptual issues of time value and risk in any study material of mine and I simply could not come up with anything like 25 marks of written response. This exam was yet another clear fail for me.

To make the ACCA exam more credible in the future I feel they need to offer the student a broader range of say 6 questions to answer over 3 hours out of say 9 options presented, not just like the present 3Qs from a vast syllabus.

Anyway, good luck to everyone – its what we all need these days with the ACCA




Buddy all I can say is don't give up you've come this far. Keep trying and you will succeed. It always looks bad when you've just done an exam and don't let that cloud your judgement. I remember a few years ago in 2009 the P2 exam was really tough and even most college teachers still agree that, that sitting was the hardest ever in P2 and not one person i knew thought they'd passed.

however when results came out every single one of my friends had passed and the pass rate for that particular sitting was 58% (the highest ever for a P2 sitting).

Personally I think its better to have a hard sitting as they mark it more generously rather then having an easy one as they mark those with a fine tooth comb and more people fail

I sincerely wish everyone all the best and that everyone passes.

Keep the faith people and as the saying goes it ain't over till the fat lady sings !

Question 1 consol was easy, knew enough waffle about operating segments and csr to gain some marks. Same with intangible assets, was shaky on revenue though. Gonna be hovering somewhere around that 50 mark I think.....

Refereing to muju's comment:

haha..really a good analysis of the question!! surely u ought to get thru acca atleast..but please dont be an examiner in the future !:) cant stop laughing!
RIDICULOUSLY TRUE!

I have passed all ACCA exams 1st time until P2. This was my second sitting having only just having failed first time round (by 2%). What an awful paper. To spend so much time learning the expanse of syllabus that is P2 to face a 25 mark qu on one IAS is really frustrating!! Also is it just me or does anyone else find it realy difficult to interpret what Mr Holt is actually asking? I think he enjoys students putting their own slant on things which is fine but leaves you really unsure if you are hitting the spot or not! Think i may need a 3rd attempt! My conclusion on P2 would be that it is entirely hit or miss, you could study the syllabus full time for a year and still struggle!

@wangeelim said:
I was rushing to complete and the invigilator has collected my paper before i realised i've FORGOTTEN to put ticks the questions i've done on the answer booklet cover.
Does this affect my marks or results in anyway?
I'm worried!

Same happened to me.

However do not worry- It is too small and meaningless and also possible to forget to tick that.

As long as you put your registration number correct and name and did a clear answer for all questions attempted no problems should be.

From what I remember- I 've forgot this also in my past exams .

Hope I pass both P2 and P3 - very time pressure exams
Already ACCA becomes very frustrating.

Hope to finish with ACCA and get with CFA as soon as possible- already I am bored of this.

@wangeelim said:
Thanks for the feedback virgilbucur. I'm glad i shade every number on top of the answer booklet. hoping to pass both P2 & P3 too!

Sit back, relax and enjoy the holidays everyone! ^^v
be back in two months time!

Happy Holidays to you too !!!

Not only the exams are a nightmare but there are some small things ( like "tick some unimportant boxes") really stressed us more :).

To much pain for this :))

was ther any impairment of goodwill in q1? The recoverable amt of both subs wer higher than net assets in the draft SOfP

I actually thought the exam was quite fair in balance.
Not to say that i did as well as i should have done!
On consolidation, didn't really do many of the adjustments as ran out of time but i did manage to try to state the principles so may get some method marks...?

Didnt do question 2.

Question 3, i said that you can not capitalise humans as that is putting a price on a person which is like slavery. I said capitalise the agents fees to start with as costs of securing contract and then expense moving forwards...
Can't even remember what I wrote other than that really!

Not sure if i passed but i worked hard and if i didnt then i am very hopeful that i will next time.

To all of you who are in doubt, when i failed f7 and f9 the first time round, i went back and studied again till my brain fell out! I passed them second time, but what i realised was that i wasn't grounded enough in the knowledge that i had and going through them again has made me more confident in my knowledge moving forwards. I think you have to see it as a positive. It gives worth to your efforts.
This time may be the same but i hope i passed because i thought the paper was fair and at this point in our studies we should all be happy that we have got this far and are close to finishing up!

I just wish that we didnt have to wait so long for results and the next round of exams to be honest.
I'll probably keep dipping in to my P2 books over the next few weeks just in case i didnt pass so i'm not completely rusty.

Yeah there was impairment I think for the first sub. The first sub goodwill was calculated on full goodwill and the second partial (proportionate) goodwill so the impairment test was slightly different ie gross up goodwill for 2nd sub

but the recoverable amount of goodwill at reporting date is much higher than it's carrying value at acquisition date...should there be any impairment?

@Shaw99Michaels, you have my full endorsement.
Its just a waste of time, ACCA have no regard for our sacrifice. Vacation used to study ACCA, Neglect family during studies, substantial financial sacrifice etc it is so demanding to the extent of slavery. Despite all your hardwork you find yourself at the mercies of the marker! Will someone beg ACCA to have mercy on us this sitting. Even if majority of us fail, ACCA marking scheme does not reflect the competence of the world Accountant's population. I am from Jamaica & my friends find it unattainable. Several of them have switched to completing their Master's & Doctorate degrees whilst the others have decided not to dare the ACCA challenge. I will not introduce ACCA to anyone for fear they will blame me for their constant failure. ACCA will outrun your life span on earth..........
One last time then I will switch to CPA. There is no guarantee that I will complete ACCA within x time, if I should quit my job to pursue it fulltime.Its getting less attractive now.

No turning back for me.I have 12 credits and 2012 is the year for P2 & P4 for me
I did not write any exams in June & December but come 2012 I will attempt all
sittings to the end....like to read the comments

Heads up for candidates attempt question 4, I think most attempt question 4.
"Entity applying the standards (refering to IAS 18) might recognise ... DO NOT FAITHFULLY represent nature... further argued ... inconsistent with principles used in other accounting standards... notion of the risk and rewards... been subjectively applied..."

4ai) Stating the IAS 18 standard not likely to earn you any marks
Inflow of economic benefits that arise from service/product provided
Transfer of risk and rewards ownership
Cost and Sale can be measured
No more managerial involvements

Question asking for (Of cos my ans is a very lousy one or may even be wrong as I am student)
- How it can be subjectively applied? Eg Sales and lease back (Finance lease) treated as sale.
- How it can be not faithful presentation/disclosure? Eg profit motivated presentation such as improving ratio and manipulate the cash in hand, sale (disposal of NCA).
- How it is inconsistent with other standards and principles? Revenue vs Lease, Impairment, Presentation; as Financial Report preparer can argue on application of IAS 18 for underlying profit motivated disclosure (as Financial Report preparer can argue on application of IAS 18)
- How US GAAP revenue recognition is like? Eg the difference between GAAP and IAS/FRS

4aii) is asking for
Credit Risk - application of IFRS 107, IAS 36
Discount rate
- how to compute? WACC, heirarchy?
- reflect the risk as whole?
-maybe FRS 109 can apply

If you are going in this direction than maybe you can pass this question, if you stating only IAS 18 requirements... you very very very very likely fail this question badly.

I not trying to scare people, but just trying to close the expectation gap. Dont get shock when result comes out.

I did not choose this question because it takes very long to Think out the answer, having 18marks on the line.. i drop it

This whole paper is impossible. Everyone say Q1 easy. It is because Q 2, 3, 4 are super difficult, which make Q1 SEEM easy.
Look at it objectively,
Q1 is not that easy, 1a- the benefit plan info presented is very unclear, the replacement cost is tiny part of IAS 16, impairment review on goodwill, 2 type of goodwill, impairment of debt asset.
compare to past paper is not really easy, maybe shorter. easy? not really.

Q1 b) Read the question properly, what they are asking for, again niches, not segment reporting general requirement, they are asking EXPENSE allocation, judgement. (I took 10 hours to dig out the 'most likely' answer to this question)

Q1 c) It wants us to talk about strategic risk, competitors risk, inconsistency of segments, shareholders' rights.

Q2 a) they make it damn complex in term of transfer.
Q2b) your group consolidation concept knowledge must be sound to answer
Q2c) only if you do every single part of 2a right, and Balance then you are able to comment.

Q3) other forumer pretty much say it all..

Objectively this P2 sitting is I M P O S S I B L E, I wont be shock to see a <30% pass rate.
I think is very unfair. Anyway ACCA will lose their footing if they set impossible standards, areas where student cannot study. If their marking is very strict, we can really forget about acca.

A giant can fall because of cumulative poor decision making, ACCA give me the impression that they using their failing rate, to maintain their reputation. It is to objectively teach the student Accounting, not use this kind of weird weird soon to be expired knowledge, or worse test area where you got NO aveune to learn, thus able to do the exam. Or try to fail students by exploiting expectation gap.

Sincerely I hope we all pass, but I mentally preparing to fail.. just hope don't give me 49, cause i will jump off the building.

PS: Those who vote ok, or easy, hahahahahahahaha... Either you are a very good student, potential prizewinner, a long time accountant, or you are simply underestimating this sitting (which you will be in shock when result comes out). Read above and you may guess how WELL you had fare the paper. I may be wrong, but I really went to search for the answers.

You are a hero. I simply decided to wait for the answers. Rather funny exam, you have your textbooks, your notebook with the Internet nearby and still no any possibility to get through having the three hours.

if you stating only IAS 18 requirements… you very very very very likely fail this question badly.

I not trying to scare people, but just trying to close the expectation gap. Dont get shock when result comes out.

I did not choose this question because it takes very long to Think out the answer, having 18marks on the line.. i drop it

You're a glass half-full kind of person then? :)
Amazed you've gone to the trouble of researching an answer when you didnt actually answer the question in the exam - good effort!

To be honest I'm glad its over, I may have passed, I may not. I'll never find out how I did on each question anyway so I'm happy to leave it now and not agonise over what I did / didnt say.

Here's to Christmas and a happy February 13th!

i thought 1 c) was about CSR vs shareholder conflicts, costs of implementing and advantage vs opinion of maximising sh wealth by only investing in the business and profit maximising strategies

zeke143, I think the main issues are judgement on disclosure, judgement on segment may be inconsistent, such as basis of geographical location vs product (thus not faithful presentation), competitive informations. Cost is valid point I think. You are right, just different way of putting it.

neilbass, I did the whole revision kit twice already, yet did not help much in this exam. I thought the exam should be more conventional, turn out to be dynamic.
I went to find out because I want to learn, not just for the sake of exam, and I wanted to share, that why this is call 'opentuition' right?

I hope everyone pass, I will speak to santa when he comes to my bedroom during xmas eve. Just pray hard to santa they are generous on marks.

add on to 4ai is construction contract.

Heyy guyz what do u think abt the p2 result....any guesses abt the passing rates

I just spent an hour looking at the Answer paper on the ACCA website. Not confident for Monday

hope for the best but prepare for the worst!
but i really2 want to pass though!