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- This topic has 8 replies, 4 voices, and was last updated 13 years ago by Anonymous.
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- May 25, 2011 at 10:42 pm #48626
Hi guys,
When dealing with trading income there is a rule which states that any expenditure (capital or revenue) within 7 years before commencement of trade can be dealt with as if it occurred on the first day of trading.
Is there a similar rule for property income? I am aware that there are allowable expenses (revenue) such as the agency costs etc… which take place before the property is rented out…. but what if I bought a property which was in awful shape and I had to spend money on capital improvements to put it into a decent shape before I start renting it out and obtaining property income? Would such expenditure be deductible in some way against the first year property income?
Thanks
May 29, 2011 at 4:15 pm #82322I think if u make any repairs etc. in the tax year then u can account for it in your Rental Income. If it was like 7 years ago, not sure. I’m thinking u might have to just record it as a loss. Maybe u should post in Ask the Tutor forum. She seems to answer pretty quickly.
May 30, 2011 at 1:30 pm #82323If the expenditure is capital in nature – than this is not an allowable expense. If the property was not in a good condition and you had to spend to ‘improve’ it as to be in better condition – this is capital..but if you had to replace – broken Roof or anything that is like replacement of an excising part of the property – it is OK even if spent before the date of the renting the property.
May 31, 2011 at 7:17 pm #82324AnonymousInactive- Topics: 23
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@grafiniata said:
If the expenditure is capital in nature – than this is not an allowable expense. If the property was not in a good condition and you had to spend to ‘improve’ it as to be in better condition – this is capital..but if you had to replace – broken Roof or anything that is like replacement of an excising part of the property – it is OK even if spent before the date of the renting the property.I’m not sure that is correct.
Spending money to improve the condition of the property, such as freshly painting the walls, is revenue expenditure and so allowable. Replacing a broken roof is not revenue expenditure, but capital expenditure.
I think?
June 1, 2011 at 5:23 am #82328Sorry to say, but you think wrong. Here we are not talking about freshly painting but repairs to bring a property in a decent shape if bought in a condition which does not allow to let out until the improvements, see the 1st post.
Replacing of a broken roof with one of the same standart is a revenue expenditure,June 1, 2011 at 1:05 pm #82329AnonymousInactive- Topics: 23
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@grafiniata said:
Sorry to say, but you think wrong. Here we are not talking about freshly painting but repairs to bring a property in a decent shape if bought in a condition which does not allow to let out until the improvements, see the 1st post.
Replacing of a broken roof with one of the same standart is a revenue expenditure,It may be that I am wrong grafiniata (I admit I am not totally sure), but I am not yet convinced otherwise.
To the best of my knowledge, the cost of initial repairs to improve an asset recently acquired to make it fit to earn profits is disallowable capital expenditure. That was the main point of the first post, and you seem to agree with what I am saying:
Quote:If the property was not in a good condition and you had to spend to ‘improve’ it as to be in better condition – this is capitalYou then gave an example of replacing a broken roof as allowable:
Quote:but if you had to replace – broken Roof or anything that is like replacement of an excising part of the property – it is OK even if spent before the date of the renting the property.and further said:
Quote:Replacing of a broken roof with one of the same standart is a revenue expenditure,I don’t think the fact that the roof is of the same standard as the original has any relevance, as we are not considering if it is an ‘improvement’ to the house. Surely if the house needs a replacement roof then it is hardly in any condition to be let, so the replacement of that roof is not a repair or a maintenance expense, it is capital expenditure to make it fit to earn profits. If you were replacing a few leaky tiles, then yes, that would be an allowable expense, but a whole roof? If I was looking to rent a house and the advert said: ‘3 bedroom detached house, great location, lovely views. No roof.’ it would put me off renting it.
On the other hand, if there was a subsidiary part of the house that needed replacing, but was not necessary for it to be brought to a condition to make it fit to earn profits, such as a new front door for example as it was letting a draught in, that would allowable revenue expenditure.
June 2, 2011 at 8:05 pm #82330AnonymousInactive- Topics: 23
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Are there any tutors who can give a decision on this one? I’d like to go into the exam knowing what was right.
June 2, 2011 at 9:43 pm #82331https://www.hmrc.gov.uk/manuals/pimmanual/pim2020.htm
Reed here, her majesty knows what is right 🙂June 2, 2011 at 10:01 pm #82333AnonymousInactive- Topics: 23
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@grafiniata said:
https://www.hmrc.gov.uk/manuals/pimmanual/pim2020.htm
Reed here, her majesty knows what is right 🙂So it confirms that a few roof tiles is revenue expenditure, but doesn’t give the example of replacing a whole roof – so you may be able to get away with it so long as you don’t put another story on the house.
But, if it is newly acquired and needs to be improved before it can be let – capital expenditure.
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